Thanx for the clarification, Cadence only needs to be in whole numbers, not bothered about decimal points of cadence/ motor rpm.
It’s only the speed off the rear wheels that is really the most important bit.
With Hall Effect sensors, is there a minimum sized magnet I can use? and should it be a N-S magnet, or a magnet from an old hard drive?
Just a thought, is it possible to make a double digit “switch” where I can just enter the desired gear number (1-28), ie push button A 1-4 times to get front gear, and button B 1-7 times for rear gears. Given I am using a gaming console for my steering wheel, I should be able to rewire the directional arrows to make the L-R for gear selection, and the U-D to move the gears automatically once the gear has been initially set.
In mitch-bogart’s Bike Gears with motor.xodball, the top 11 debug boolean tweak nodes are single T/F devices, so what would I have to change to make the X-Box 360 console swithces function with the Xodball?
The more I’m thinking about all the possibilities of XOD and micro computing, the more I want “to push the boundaries” ( yeah yeah, I know learn the tutorials first!)
The reason I ask, is I’m thinking that due to the huge gearing, I want it to automatically reset back to 1st gear every time the bike is stopped for more than a minute or two, so that i can get it started again, and then just select which gear I want to be in.
Continuation of above thought; if my steering wheel rotates more than the wiring allows, I’m gonna rip the wiring to shreds, so … Is it possible to have the switches on my steering wheel running through a Bluetooth type device so that there are wires getting twisted?
If so, which bits do I use?
I found this great graph that someone spent a lot of time on to answer your question 
https://sensorso.com/resources/selecting-the-appropriate-hall-effect-sensor-and-target-magnet.html
It looks like it depends only on the gap from sensor to magnet. So for a 0.5" gap or less, you need a 30-76 Gauss magnet. It later shows that a N-S magnet is best.
I just checked Amazon and 30 of these are really cheap and have way more strength than that!
https://www.amazon.com/Craft-Magnets-Ceramic-Refrigerator-Whiteboard/dp/B07S75MD7X
The blurb says 4200 gauss!
The smallest I can find are 450 gauss. Probably need to hot glue in place or something. (After using a compass to determine the N-S direction to aim at the sensor.)
https://www.amazon.com/Acupressure-Magnetic-Patches-Sheets-Magnets/dp/B00J2X8OZY
Everyone want to sell the strongest they can.
It looks like any magnets you get will be strong enough.
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I’m sort of old school, and not a serious biker.
You have a system that has near instant random access gear changing of 28 gears! From a systems point of view it’s almost criminal to require up to 11 sequential (time-taking) actions to switch gears.
What I’d like is, starting from yours is:
L-R for fine change,
U-D for coarse change, and
Additional, instant, “Presto” buttons.
If not 28 such buttons, then 14 of them (gears 1, 3, 5 …28), or even just 9 of them (1, 4, 7, 10, 13, 16, 19, 22, 25, 28). Nine seems very workable.
1 and 28 could be separated out as buttons elsewhere “Lowest” and “Highest”. Then you just need 8 instant access buttons, 4 on the left (4, 7, 10, 13), and 4 on the right (16, 19, 22, 25).
Press 7 --> zip, Press 22 --> zip!
If you do this, you might you might want to change the L-R to be +1/-1 and the UP down (if needed at all) to a coarse +3/-3 (which matches the gear index spacing, but it could be anything (+6/-6 also matches that spacing)
There is a lot of flexibility. My main point is that if your hardware is capable of random access, that should be passed to the boss, You, the user! Even better and faster than Shimono! A write-up in a biking mag. if you’re into that.
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Again, I’m old school a bit. Bluetooth takes power, sometimes gets interfered with or drops out, and overall is just not as reliable as wires - if you can handle the flexing problem.
These might be expensive, but their site is educational.
https://www.cicoil.com/flat-cable/learn-more/keys-to-high-flexibility
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If I was to use the left thumb pad I could use it for +/-3 U/D and +/-6 L-R, but how do I get the mechanical switch to function in the circuity world?
I’m currently trying to buy another X-Box 360 steering wheel, or 2 or 3!, 'cos I think I cut out all the “non essential wires” at that time I was getting the steering wheel converted from electronic to mechanical, back in 2010
R TP switches U R D L = R1-4 ; R1 & R3 single +/- FG & R2 & R4 single +/- RG
L TP switches U R D L = Presto1-4; PL = +3 PU = +6 PR =-3 PD = -6
that’s 8 switches, and if G1 is technically G0, then i should be sweet going through all gears, and then fine tuning if needed as well and get it to reset to G0 when stationary for more than a minute
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I had to reread that a few times until I got it!
The right touch pad gives you quick up and down by 1 for front and rear gears. I guess if you’re a biker you like to stay in touch with which gears, front or back, you are changing. Not so for the left touch pad.
I think you switched to the programming (and XOD) use of 0-based rather than 1-based). Good move by me. FG is 0-3 and RG is 0-6
So lets see if I have this right.
The left TP has no connection to front or rear gears at all. Those are invisible.
So say you are in FG2 and RG6, overall gear is 20 (FG x 7 + RG),
and you press PL (+3). You go directly to overall gear 23, which is
FG3 and RG2 ( FG = ovgear / 7 and BG = ovgear mod 7).
And there’s no gear hopping - both gears change at once, getting you 3 gears higher, as fast as possible, with no mental calculations at all.
A slightly better and improved interpretation of “Presto”. I like it.
And you find both methods valuable, right?
Definitely cool.
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How about just using two of these - matching Right and Left 4 position (each a button press) joysticks. No pots. They even have the lever looking like a gear shift with a boot.
4 digital inputs for each joystick. There are easy tricks if you want to reduce the pins needed to 1 analog pin per joystick. Only if needed.
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This is the non-knockoff version and they show the size specifications.
Whoa! It is big - 3" above panel.
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@Mitch-Bogart
The steering wheel/console is pretty tight for space, so the devices you showed would be too sticky outy for the confines of the cockpit.
That’s why I’d prefer to use the L/R TP rocker switches; within thumb reach, & both hands on steering wheel at all times.
The LTP even if in say Gear 19 automatically hits either 21 or 26 or 18 & 15.
I can then use RTP to adjust from 18 to 19 or 20 if I so desire.
@mitch-bogart
I’d prefer the LTP to only work in +/-0, 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18, 21, 24, 27
&
+/- 0, 6, 12, 18, 24
The RTP allows me to then work with the other gears
Forgot about the steering wheel I had an image of handlebars in my mind. So yup, 4-way rocker switches win bigtime.
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For the LTP, it appears those are still relative shifts (or are they absolute).
If you are in gear 3 and want to get to gear 23, what do you do?
You press LTP Up and get to 9, or would it be 6?
Say it’s 6. Then you press LTP Up again twice and get to 18. Then you switch to the RTP? How do you go up 5? Which rockers do you push on RTP, the front or the back?
Instead, say the first LTP Up gets you to 9. Then what, 2 more LTP Ups get you to 21. Then 2 RTP Ups get you to 23.
Imho, I think it is simpler to have the RTP be allways relative and the LTP be allways absolute.
RTP does +1/-1 for right and left and +3/-3 for up and down.
LTP instantly goes to 6, 12, 18, and 24 regardless of your current gear.
Left and Right go to 12 and 18.
Up and Down go to 24 and 6. (or whatever you find logical). Then you fine tune and use RTP to make small relative adjustment(s).
There is no need to keep front and rear gear consciousness in your head (it can be displayed on the screen if helpful).
In the above example, you are on 3 and want to get to 23. Two pushes. One LTP Up press gets you to 24. Then one RTP Left push goes down 1 to 23.
(Alternatively, if you like only going up, you can do four pushes:
One LTP Right push to get to 18, then one +3 on RTP (Up) gets you to 21, and then two +1s on RTP (Right) gets you to 23.
There is another, racing advantage. Repeated clicks to go through overall gears sequentially involves many unnecessary back and forth derailleur movements for both the front and back derailleurs. Actually I think this is what you should optimize for. It provides quick small relative overall gear changes (RTP), and very quick and direct absolute quantum jumps to any gear (LTP), no matter how far from present gear. It also reduces wear and tear on your derailleurs.
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@mitch-bogart
Due to the nature of The Beast, “Down Under Fast Recumbent Quadcycle F-RQ”, I will only be going upwards through the gears, then slowing down to stop and change my undies and get my breath back.
Not doing long hours of recreational riding.
Therefore, the LTP is absolute +/-3 & +/-6
LTP-L = 0 +3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27
LTP-U = 0 +6 12 18 24
LTP-R = -3 to next in reducing sequence
LTP-D = -6
If in G19, and I hit -3, it drops me to G18, and if I hit -6 it also drops me to G18
In G17, -3 drops me to G15 but -6 drops me to G12
In G19, hitting +3 takes me up to G21
And +6 takes me to G24
That’s what I’d call Presto Gear Changing 
Then the RTP is
L = -1 RG
U = +1 FG
R = +1 RG
D = -1 FG
I now understand the RTP for a biker. You know what front and rear gear you are in and you want to be able increment/decrement either the front or the back. The gear jumps on front and back are different and they multiply so a good biker needs the ability to do this.
The LTP still seems a little illogical. What are the rules?
In G19, -3, drops me to G18 Because: why?
In G19 -6 also drops me to G18 Because: why?
In G17, -3 drops me to G15 but Because: why?
In G17 -6 drops me to G12 Because: why?
In G19, +3 takes me up to G21 Because: why?
In G19 +6 takes me to G24 Because: why?
I know I’m missing something here 
@mitch-bogart
Most probably seems illogical because we’re talking about MY logic not everyone else’s logic 
The F-RQ, with it’s mega gearing, isn’t your typical 4-wheeled push bike, ( not that a 4-wheeled push bike IS conventional!) and as such “conventional logic” may need to be suspended for a season.
As the pilot of F-RQ, the difference between 3 gears is considerable, I have to physically be able to push my legs to keep driving in whatever gear I’m in.
Mentally, I can wrap my head around gear increments of +/- 3 or +/-6, they are stable points of reference I can fall back to, and then work back up the gears till I get to one I can maintain my cadence in.
So G19;
+3 -> G21 (closest upper multiple of 3)
+6 -> G24 ( closest upper multiple of 6)
-6 -> G18 ( closest lower multiple of 6)
-3 -> G18 ( closest lower multiple of 3)
G17
+3 -> G18 (closest upper multiple of 3)
+6 -> G18 (closest upper multiple of 6)
-6 -> G12 (closest lower multiple of 6)
-3 -> G15 (closest lower multiple of 3)
G1
+3 -> G3
+6 -> G6
G2
+3 -> G3
+6 -> G6
G3
-3 -> G1
+3 -> G6
+6 -> G6
G4
+3 -> G6
+6 -> G6
-3 -> G3
G5
+3 -> G6
+6 -> G6
-3 -> G3
G6
+3 -> G9
+6 -> G12
-6 -> G1
-3 -> G3
G7
+3 ->G9
+6 -> G12
-6 -> G6
-3 -> G6
G8
+3 -> G9
+6 -> G12
-6 -> G6
-3 -> G6
G9
+3 -> G12
+6 -> G12
-6 -> G6
-3 -> G6
G10
+3 -> G12
+6 -> G12
-6 -> G6
-3 -> G9
G11
+3 -> G12
+6 -> G12
-6 -> G6
-3 -> G9
G12
+3 -> G15
+6 -> G18
-6 -> G6
-3 -> G9
G13
+3 -> G15
+6 -> G18
-6 -> G12
-3 -> G12
G14
+3 -> G15
+6 -> G18
-6 -> G12
-3 -> G12
G15
+3 -> G18
+6 -> G18
-6 -> G12
-3 -> G12
G16
+3 -> G18
+6 -> G18
-6 -> G12
-3 -> G15
G18
+3 -> G21
+6 -> G24
-6 -> G12
-3 -> G15
G20
+3 -> G21
+6 -> G24
-6 -> G18
-3 -> G18
G21
+3 -> G24
+6 -> G24
-6 -> G18
-3 -> G18
G22
+3 -> G24
+6 -> G24
-6 -> G18
-3 -> G21
G23
+3 -> G24
+6 -> G24
-6 -> G18
-3 -> G21
G24
+3 -> G27
-6 -> G18
-3 -> G21
G25
+3 -> G27
-6 -> G24
-3 -> G24
G26
-6 -> G24
-3 -> G24
G27
-6 -> G24
-3 -> G24
G28
-6 -> G24
-3 -> G27
I got your logic, I think. This (still is?) a big community!
To prove to myself that I understand your logic I XODed the calculations part with simulation tweaks and watches so you can check it out, too. Uploaded should be a capture of simulation of LTP-D (-6) when current gear is 17. New gear is 12.
You actually spelled out the rule with,
“LTP-L = 0 +3 6 9 12 15 18 21 24 27
LTP-U = 0 +6 12 18 24
LTP-R = -3 to next in reducing sequence
LTP-D = -6”
It was the examples that really helped.
One question - For the RTP operation is there wraparound? If you do a rear gear +1 from top rear gear 6 do you wrap around to the next front gear and set rear gear to 0?
!
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LTP for Down Under F-RQ.xodball (16.3 KB)
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